So far Mercury mechanics said they have never heard of this problem and have failed to correct this, and will easter-egg it even more. Car is a 2007 Mercury Grand Marquis GS with 12,500 miles and started this with only 600 miles on it. Car starts normally until the gas cap is removed(for refueling). Then it only starts when cranked for 3 or 4 tries and only if you keep cranking and continuously pumping the gas pedal, then it slowly rises in rpm''s (on the tach). Then it will "catch" and rev up to 3000 rpm. Hold it above 1500 rpm for a minute. Then two pedal it and keep it above 1000 rpm when putting in drive. It will want to stall until driven a few minutes at 35 mph. I figure its the vacuum system not right and causing the new-fangled expensive injector/plug parts to be "vacuum locked" in the fuel delivery. Does anyone else have this problem?

First,you should never have to press the gas pedal on a fuel injected car when starting it. You will burn out the plugs. You only do that on carburated cars.


Are you refueling the car with it still running or taking off the cap when the car is still running? if so it sends a code to the emissions computer and causes the car to have to be started after 3 cranks to burn off running fuel vapors.


Check your plugs, you might be getting too much gas on them by pumping the gas pedal when you start it and this is what after the plugs get hot the cars runs better. This can also be caused by the fuel pressure being inconsitant and doing it throught he computer

If you just crank it over, it never starts, you MUST keep the gas pedal moving in order for the computer to put fuel to the engine; must lose its idle brain and only apply an acceleration signal to the fuel injectors. There are no "plugs"...these are integral fuel injector/coil/plug assemblies; unlike you''ve ever seen before...don''t equate to earlier setups....don''t know what the book officially calls them, I call them "The $500 spark plugs, another billiant idea".


Experiment 1: Car idling at 700 rpm, remove gas cap...engine idle revved to 1500, then settled back to about 800 rpm. Put cap back on (no fuel added), after a few seconds idle returned to 700 rpm.


Experiment 2: Fuel up with car in idle. Car idling about 700 rpm, removed gas cap, revved and settled as before in experiment 1. Adding fuel...first i added fuel too fast (half way open on spigot) car started to lose idle and strained to keep running. Immediately stopped fuel flow, car recovered after about 30 sec and returned to normal idle. Slowly added fuel until that point was reached and then backed off fuel flow until car ridled normally (about 1/4 open on spigot).


And setting the A/C on has no affect on the above starting...so computer also doesn''t step up the idle it for the above starting.


Mercury mechanics replaced the "vacuum control module" and car acted normal for one week...then back to the original problem. On earlier models we called it "the starship enterprise". It is the vacuum /pressure switching for the gas tank lines from the carb to the charcoal bed when running / off.

OH, I forgot....


Cap was always removed about 3 to 5 minutes after turning the car off...time to walk in, stand in line, pay for gas, and return to the pump.

tcm1,


I am thinking it is a good thing it is under warranty. You might want to talk to the dealer mechanic manag:ment. go online and find out about "the lemon law". let them know you intend on getting a law suite for this car being unfixable if they can not fix it and make sure they give you a rental car for free. Sometimes it gets them scared because Ford usually will not reimberse them for over1 year when they lose in a law suite because they could not fix it.


with a car being this new and under warranty it is best to not fix anything yourself because you can be held liable. It is an easy way out for them. I have seen it done before to people because the dealer knows the ford company will not reimberse them. Email me and i can help you with info on the lemon law. maybe we can get this fixed if we scare them

some times you can have your car insurance guy write a letter explaning that you intend ongoing through with the lemon law if they do not fix it. if you have a good insurance guy he can put you intouch with the right lawyer for freeor he can just give you a letter and it is enough for them to fix the car the correct way. make sure they compensate you with a rental and you are not charged for miles.

Jason, Thanks...I''ve let them know the last shop visitthat this is the official beginning of prep for the lemon law to apply. Next Sat is the next appointment, with rental car at their expense. I have a 3yr bumper to bumper warranty, so there''s plenty of time for them to waste thousands of Ford''s dollars; which I''ve told them too in that "after Ford wastes a few thou and I waste manhours and expense and inconvienience bring it here, maybe you''ll decide to buy it back and make it a 2 ft cube." But they are in the denial stage...it''ll take a few more visits and mega bucks before they think otherwise.


Actually I like the car...wish they could finally fix it...just wish I could be a normal person when fueling...its a pain to wait for the end pump, or an out of the way pump, to be empty while getting looks for not just using an empty pump; so I can push it forward out of the way if/when it don''t start, and then getting many snears when it finally starts and I have to rev it and keep it rev''d until I drive it for awhile at 35 mph.


Other than the embarrassing and excruciating refuelings (one time I''m sure will be its last refuel in its original assembled life - boneyard after that)...its a great car.

I am sorry you got a bad one. These are great cars,sometimes and not that often, this hapens to every kind of car in the millions they make. I hope it works out for you. The best way is to show them a letter saying you are going to pursue a law suite and then they know you are not playing around. It really does not matter if they are in denial, when the letter is in there hand they will fix it right away.





Good luck

And I gave them an option at the shop...


Rip out this driveline and drop in a 1965 289 or a 1968 302; remove all the computer junk, and I''d be more than happy....


I grew up rebuilding those drive trains...and can work on them in my sleep. Was two weeks away from being certified Ford mechanic before Nam came along for me.


But none of their mechanics knew what I was talking of....too bad we have lost so much skills.... and they have become mindless slaves to computer error codes...with little to no troubleshooting and analytical skills of their own...just the easter egg replace and see approaches...

And I love it when I tell them a $4 broom handle will tell them more about whats going on than any $50,000 computer....and then I show them and explain every noise they hear as we work our way around the drive train...


Always get a kick out of that, andtheir surprised expressions when they first hear the sounds and can''t believe it is that simple...and when I explain what different problems will sound like, different from the normal sounds, and which parts are bad or wearing out...


Well thanks for your help and advice....

they will never take out the motor and put in an older version. Actuall yhte motor that is n there is one of the best that Ford has ever put out. You just got a bad one. The electrical stuff is pretty easy when it is undrrstood. I think you got a car that has a hard to find problem and the dealer does not have the experience to fix it. With the car sales being down, they are not going to jump at it unless you have a letter. they like to do quick fix stuff and charge ford a huge time amount for repairs. They need to drop the gas tank and fully inspect it and the fuel sensors and everything that runs up to the fuel filter. Your problem seems like it is in the tank, thats why codes are not going off and they can not find it.

Hey one more thing, try to keep your cool when talking to them and the mechanics. it makes they mechanic look bad infront of the boss when he can not fix it. If they do have to drop the tank, I have seen P O mechanics say it was abuse or something was put in the gas that was not suppose to be in there Like sugar or something and that is why it is this way, so therefor it is not covered under warranty.So be cool and just let them know you are a stand up honest guy that just wants it fixed correctly

Sounds like it''s time to get the Ford regional rep involved. I bet it would get fixed much faster.

I am wondering if the charcoal canister is getting loaded up with fuel vapors somehow and when you open the gas cap atmoshperic pressure is pushing the fuel thru the evap line and flooding the manifold with vapors or raw fuel. I would look at the hose from the purge solanoid and see if you can see any fuel or maybe just unplug it and after refueling it see if you have the same problem. Also a side note. When the computer sees the accellerator pedal is to the floorwhile cranking it goes into "clear Flood mode" much like how you would clear the old carb cars. This mode turns off the injectors so only air goes into the engine to help it restart. If you pump it or hold it half way the injectors will be injecting and with an already flooded engine that doesn''''t help. Also what about the amount of fuel. Does it do it when only filling or does it do it with 1 or two gallons? Edited by: scott89racin

I never put the pedal more than 1/2 way down when starting it, and vary the pedal from almost full up to 1/4 down while cranking, just enough to fool the computer into continuing to apply an acceleration signal....the car has never been flooded....there is no manifold, fuel is railed to each "injector"....(previous posts)...the car refuses to start evenif NO fuel is put in...also see the earlier posts with experiment 1 and 2....


But ya know...maybe you have another hint to look at if the pressure/vacuum relieved from the tank causes the computer to think it needs any clear mode while cranking...Thanks...

I am curious now. I have been out of the car business for a4 years (I worked on cars for 14 years)now but since when did they get rid of intake manifolds? If this is true then how does it get air to each cylinder?does the car smell flooded or not? Also maybe ashot of starting fluid to see if it is spark or fuel related.

the best way to get a good night sleep over this is to just get the rep like scott89mracing said or a lawyer involved. trying to fix this yourself may hold you responsible when you are dealing with the lemon law. Since you are not certified and this is a problem they have no idea about, leave it to the law experts and have them get you a new car.